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Discussing: Mahtan and Nerdanel

Mahtan and Nerdanel

I've been going through the famous Quenya course and picked up some interesting things. Apparently, stress is applied to the second last syllable in a Quenya word. Now I need to know if the name Nerdanel is in Quenya or Sindarin to know how to say it, also need to know this about the name Mahtan. And does anyone know what the names mean? Thanks!



Re: Mahtan and Nerdanel

Oh and one more question! What do Tengwar number 19 and 20 represent? Ta!



Re: Mahtan and Nerdanel

Now I need to know if the name Nerdanel is in Quenya or Sindarin Quenya is Greek to me, so I can't help you there... but Mahtan and Nerdanel both predate the Noldorin exile, so I believe their names must be in Quenya, rather than Sindarin. - Barbara



Re: Mahtan and Nerdanel

I think you may have misunderstood something here. The stress patterns for Quenya and Sindarin are the same, and they're a little more complicated than that. I believe it goes something like this (somebody jump in and correct me if this is off): The next-to-last syllable is stressed if it has (1) a long vowel (with an accent mark) (2) a dipthong (combined vowels, like "ai") or (3) two or more consonants after the vowel. Otherwise, the stress moves to the previous syllable, the third from the end. Nerdanel (it's Quenya, not that it matters) has a short vowel followed by one consonant in the second syllable, so the stress would be on the first, NER-dan-el.



Re: Mahtan and Nerdanel

LOL no, all that about stress rules is right... But! There are two consonants following A, that is, N and L. Right? Or am I just lost? I used to say it NERdanel but I think it should be NerDANel now... I think I'm lost! Or maybe... N and L can't be counted as two consonants because they're separated by E?



Re: Mahtan and Nerdanel

So what about the Sindarin Celeborn? Am I right in saying it would be CE-leb-orn?



Re: Mahtan and Nerdanel

NER-dan-el would be correct, as the final 'n' and 'l' are in different syllables. If there are at least two consonents together after the vowel in the next to last syllable - as in govannen, the stress would be there - gov-AN-nen. Note that some consonant digraphs, such as ‘dh’, are counted as only one consonant. And yes, Celeborn would have the accent on the first syllable. Hope that helps, Ithildin *(



Re: Mahtan and Nerdanel

Thanks While we're here, can somebody translate this for me? You are the cutest/fairest and I want to be with you always... TIA



Re: Mahtan and Nerdanel

GAH! Is it NOLdorin or nolDORin?!?



Re: Mahtan and Nerdanel

Into Quenya? Natyë/nalyë ambanima, ar merin asetyë/aselyë illumë natyë - you are (familiar) nalyë - you are (formal) ambanima - an + vanima: most fair (since vanima is from a stem ban, n+v becomes mb) ar - and merin - I want/desire, aorist tense asetyë - with you (informal) aselyë - with you (formal) illumë - always I've left out 'to be' in the second half of the sentence, which you can do in Quenya, and that is a good thing here, since we don't know the infinitive of 'to be'...



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