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Discussing: Some (sort of ) geographical questions

Some (sort of ) geographical questions

Hi,
Would anyone be able to help me by telling me if there are any desert-like places close enough to Gondor that Gondorian soldiers might do battle there? Sort of on the same topic if Boromir has been a soldier all his life (*pause while I wonde whether that is canon or fanon*) then whom has he been fighting?


Thanks,

Avon

 

 

Re: Some (sort of ) geographocal questions

Hi Avon,

The only deserts in that part of ME are east and south of Mordor, the land of Khand and then further south yet to Haradwaith (and inland from the sea). None of it particularily close to Minas Tirith and at that time Boromir lived Ithink they were having a hard time just holding the cities (early in the third age - around the year 933-1050 the south kingdom of Gondor included Umbar and Hara was a tributary).

Boromir was born in TA 2978. In 2951 Sauron openly declared himself and around the year 3000 it says the shadow of Mordor deepened. I have always thought that Boromir and Faramir had spent their lives battling Mordor. The easterlings from the east, the hardadrim from the south were in league with Sauron; the orcs and others that served him all had to pass near to Gondor's lands if not through them. The Harad Road passed through Ithilien on its eastern border to get to the black gates

Hope that helps some!
Nilmandra

 

 

Re: Some (sort of ) geographical questions

Ooh, that isn't what I wanted to hear - but thank you. I need sand! I wants it my precioussss! I had a nasty feeling that there weren't going to be any convenient deserts - I'll just have to work on a convenient sandy bank of the Anduin, I think. *sulk* Thanks a bunch for the other info too - it's a great help.

Cheers,

Avon

 

 

Re: Some (sort of ) geographical questions

Hmmm. Would the brown lands be a possible candidate? Don't know how desert-like they would be, and no time to look it up, but I do remember it was where they thought the Entwives' gardens might have been before (sauron?) blasted them (?)

Sorry, feeling vaguer by the moment.

 

 

Re: Some (sort of ) geographical questions

Hmm....if all you need is sand, I am sure there must be some along the Anduin. Or, send them to visit Uncle Imrahil in Dol Amroth? I would like to imagine that Dol Amroth had some nice sandy beaches, if that would work in your story.

If not, send me. I'd gladly spend some time on the sandy beaches with Prince Imrahil.

Nilmandra

 

 

Re: Some (sort of ) geographical questions

Hmm....if all you need is sand, I am sure there must be some along the Anduin. Or, send them to visit Uncle Imrahil in Dol Amroth? I would like to imagine that Dol Amroth had some nice sandy beaches, if that would work in your story.

Nah, I feel Uncle Imrahil would rather I didn't kill a horse all over his sand ;-) Thanks for the thought and the suggestion though. The silly thing is of course that at the moment this all relates to one sentence in a fic - though I do have hopes of pulling it out and turning it into a little fic if I ever finish this original one. It might also seem logical to simply change the sentence and let this horse die elsewhere - but when I write I tend to get pictures and I find it hard to ignore them. Daft, huh?

Thanks again,

Avon

 

 

Re: Some (sort of ) geographical questions

Thanks for the idea, lindelea. I think - but I don't actually know - that they might also be too far from Gondor. I'll check them out.

Avon

 

 

Cliffs in or near Tookland

Am writing a cliffhanger. Yes, really. And I was wondering if there might be a geographic possibility of a cliff in or near the Green Hill country, preferably with a path running along the top of the cliff, or the side of the cliff. Anybody got an idea on this?

Am also brain dead at the moment, but that is an unrelated issue. I think.

 

 

Re: Cliffs in or near Tookland

Depends upon the kind of cliff you want someone hanging from.

Something like was in the movie could occur quite naturally as long as there was a tall enough hill for part of a side to erode away. I'd say Green Hill country is a likely place for reasonably high hills (particularly to a Hobbit), unlike the moors in Northfarthing, or the river lowlands near Buckland.

Toodles - Ang

 

 

The Tower Hills?

Does anyone have any thought on these? Are they limestone formations, with natural caves occurring (I know I must have spelled that wrong, I always get it wrong no matter how I spell it)? ...leading to ease of construction of Undertowers....

Would they be barren, have some sort of vegetation on them?

What are the towers themselves like, do you think? I don't remember much description at all in LOTR, is there more in one of the other books?

Anyhow, I am trying to remember what I know of caves (used to know a lot more than I know now... gradual erosion of memory...)

Thanks!
Lin

 

 

Re: Snow

Would it snow in Gondor - in Minas Tireth or only in the mountains?


Avon

 

 

Re: Snow

Well, given the Mediterranean nature of Ithilien, which is at the same latitude, I would say no. The climate is probably like that of southern France. I think you would definitely get snow in Rohan and in the mountains, and in a particularly cold winter a dusting of snow maybe on the higher elevations of Mindolluin.

 

 

Re: Snow

Avon, according to Letters of JRR Tolkien, Minas Tirith is about the latitude of Florence. I believe snow would be a very rare event there, so probably only in the mountains.

Lyllyn

Edited: Ooops, Granamyr, I type slow.

 

 

Re: Snow

Drat. This is one of those moments where I wish I swore ;-) Hmmm.... either I move the Stewards family up the mountains for a holiday or I go AU-climate ;-)

Thanks a lot, guys, though.

Avon

 

 

Re: Snow

It having just occurred to me that I now own the Atlas of Middle Earth I've had a quick look that. IT seems to think Gondor's climate is akin to England's - which means I could postulate a snowy winter at least some times, couldn't I?

Thanks again,

Avon

 

 

Re: Snow

Hi Avon,

I was looking at the Atlas of Middle Earth also - and it says Mild Winter/Warm Summer - and she likens it to Eastern Europe and in the US, Arkansas to Wisconsin. Also, Minas Tirith is built into the end of those hills, so the sea effect would be lessened, I would think. I would think they must get snow and perhaps the occasional winter that has more than normal. It sure happens here! I don't think it would be a stretch to occasionally have a snowy winter.

One more opinion
Nilmandra

 

 

Re: Snow

I agree with Nilmandra about the climate in general. I would think that snow in the mountains would be a real probability. And Rohan definitely got snow, even discounting the Long Winter when the snows stayed on the ground into April. Given Minas Tirith's location, you can easily chose for it to have the best of the more temperate climate as well as the colder, snowy winters in the hilly regions. Note Bormomir's comment as the Fellowship prepared to take on the pass over Caradhras: .''I will add a word of advice, if I may,' said Boromir. 'I was born under the shadow of the White Mountains and know something of journeys in the high places. We shall meet bitter cold, if no worse, before we come down on the other side.

BTW don't forget that Tolkien aways had the weather patterns moving from west to east, except when Sauron was messing things up during the Ring War (the weather had an unusual east to west pattern which was much remarked upon at various points in LotR)

~Nessime
*yet another opinion

 

 

Re: Some (sort of ) geographical questions

Well, I *live* in the desert, and very little of what passes for landscaping is *sand*. The big sand dunes that you always associate with the desert are actually pretty rare.

However, sand bars can, and do, build up on alluvial plains. Given that Ithilien seems to be such a plain, it is quite likely that one of the streams would have left behind sandy deposits.

As for *snow*, it does snow here. It was 110 F here today (42 C). Yet we get snow almost every winter, and the first winter we lived here we were snowed in.

Freak storms can occur--it has actually snowed in Los Angeles, for instance.

I would expect the Steward's family to occupy the same general niche as Royalty--ie, they probably go and inspect various fortresses, towns, etc. During one of these trips they almost certainly would encounter snow.

khazar

 

 

Re: Snow

Thanks, Nilmandra and Nessime! This is just one of the many reasons why I love this place - someone will always spare a few minutes to help you. I was thinking about Boromir's remarks pre-Mt Caradhras then I thought maybe it would only be up in the mountains I need him to be no more than an hours (or less) walk from home.

Cool.

Avon

 

 

Re: Some (sort of ) geographical questions

Thanks, Khazar! I did eventually solve my sand problem by having the horse beeld to death on a bank of the Anduin (You will Always be my Brother).

You sure do have extremes of temperatures where you are! It gets that hot in Sydney but we don't get snow ;-( I'll use the off on a trip excuse if i have to but if I can make it snow at MT all the better as I need the snow to coincide with Boromir's mother's death.

Cheers and thanks,
Avon

 

 

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